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jafa 
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Joined: Jul. 2008
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Posted on: Mar. 29 2011,11:28 |
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As I am about to hit a significant birthday (sigh......), I thought I would gift myself a new rod and was wondering about a switch/short spey (or both...).
I've done quite a bit of interent research, and at the moment, "which brand" doesn't worry me. What I am perplexed over is rod (and line) weight. I would have thought a 5wt switch would have been adequate for NZ trout, maybe a 6wt is overkill. Spey pages reckons that a 6wt is overpowered for trout less than 20" and that a 5wt is a better trout rod. If so, why does Airflo come out with a 8wt switch rod for NZ conditions?? Isn't this complete overkill? Afterall, most swtich and spey rods are designed with Scottish/Atlantic salmon or Pacific Northwest Steelhed as the target, much bigger fish than the NZ trout (even the NZ rainbow steelhead fishery that is Tauupo).
So 5wt or 6wt or 8wt? And why.
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| Post Number: 2
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Kakahi
Group: Members
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Joined: Feb. 2006
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Posted on: Mar. 29 2011,17:56 |
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Interesting thread.
I would have thought you would tune you rod weight to the size water you're intending to fish, and the size and weight of flies you're intending to chuck.
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Secret Creek photos
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| Post Number: 3
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jafa
Group: Members
Posts: 90
Joined: Jul. 2008
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Posted on: Mar. 29 2011,19:23 |
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Absolutely, I agree. The intended waters are the Tongariro and Whanganui, at least initially. Maybe once I get proficient at casting, by which I mean accurate at distance, not just distance, I may go on to other waters. So the application is "think usual Tongariro conditions, both summer and winter".
I was thinking of both upstream nymphing w usual heavy bombs as well as streamers down and across. Also soft hackles upstream and down.
All of this still leaves me wondering, why not a 5wt switch or short Spey, why did Airflo go for 8wt configuration?? To paraphrase Clarke (NZ cicada) from a prior thread, isn't a big swtich/spey configuration, in NZ conditions a least, a bit like having sex with four condoms on?
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| Post Number: 4
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stu#71
Think, like a trout!
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Posted on: Mar. 29 2011,20:18 |
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Stu (Kakahi) has it.
You can land large trout on a 4wt if you like. It just takes longer so I would go away from thinking the weight of the rod needed is relative to the size of the fish.
Think more that if you wanna throw large, heavy flies for example, in faster, larger waters you'll need a bigger gun, irrespective of the size of fish.
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| Post Number: 5
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Tore
Group: Members
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Joined: Jul. 2006
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Posted on: Mar. 29 2011,20:48 |
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(jafa @ Mar. 29 2011,19:23)
QUOTE Absolutely, I agree. The intended waters are the Tongariro and Whanganui, at least initially. Maybe once I get proficient at casting, by which I mean accurate at distance, not just distance, I may go on to other waters. So the application is "think usual Tongariro conditions, both summer and winter".
I was thinking of both upstream nymphing w usual heavy bombs as well as streamers down and across. Also soft hackles upstream and down.
All of this still leaves me wondering, why not a 5wt switch or short Spey, why did Airflo go for 8wt configuration?? To paraphrase Clarke (NZ cicada) from a prior thread, isn't a big swtich/spey configuration, in NZ conditions a least, a bit like having sex with four condoms on?
Wouldn't chucking Tongariro bombs with a 5wt line be a challenge? To say the least...?
Which COULD be why Airflo went for an 8wt...?
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| Post Number: 6
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jafa
Group: Members
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Joined: Jul. 2008
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Posted on: Mar. 29 2011,21:07 |
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This is where I am confused. There is a difference between a 4wt (or 5,6,8wt) single handed fly rod and a 4wt (or 5,6,8wt) switch or spey rod, isn't there?? I know the DH or Spey lines are completely different to SH fly lines, the grain weights are completely different. I have alway assumed the weight (not the SH fly rodweight) given to the switch/spey rod matched the spey line weight , which is why a 5wt switch/spey rod is lined by either a 5wt spey line (or equivalent, depending on purpose) or an 8wt SH fly line.
Which gets back to my first question: Is a 5/6wt switch spey rod (thus throwing a 8/9wt SH line) too much for NZ conditions? Or to ask it another way, if the AirFlo Switch is 8wt switch rated (which is 10-11wt SH equivalent), is this also not overkill??
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| Post Number: 7
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TomWatt4642
A real man never cook!!
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Posted on: Mar. 29 2011,21:33 |
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Jafa, I have a 6110-4 ZA switch and just started to handle nicely. I use Airflo 40+ 8 weight and feels a bit heavy but can cast nicely(mind you 40+ shooting head is 2 line size heavier than SH lines!). You are right in that the line rating for DH and switch is different than SH. Very specialized rod in NZ terms and personally, a 11ft 5weight would make really versatile/interesting rod!, swinging streamers dry flies, high sticking cezch lake fishing from float tube just anything. I think a 11ft 5 or 6 weight switch will fish Tongariro nicely.
I have not cast Airflo 8weight, but you gotta realize that there is no way of rating line weight for any rods!! so if they say 8 weight the rod becomes 8 weight. Airflo 8 wight may be close to ZA#6 in power wise because ZA is a fast action. I think Chris uses a Airflor switch.
It really depends on what water you fish and like everyone says depends on what fly/line system(sinking level lines etc) you are throwing rather than the size of the fish you catching.
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Flyfishing is my life and that is what I am here in New Zealand for. Nothing is more important than flyfishing IMO.
Tom Watanabe, Senior Structural Engineer,
BE(Struct.), ME(Struct, Dist), MIPENZ, IntPE, CPEng
First Class Kenchikushi (JPN)
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| Post Number: 8
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stu#71
Think, like a trout!
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Posted on: Mar. 29 2011,21:45 |
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Hi jaffa - I'm confused also now ;)
I think we need to go back a step...I do anyway!!!
"Spey" lines, very simply speaking, are extreme weight forward loaded lines, followed by a thin running line. The idea, again very simply speaking, is to load the rod with minimal "head" line out of the tip, then fire out the running line.
A Switch rod is just a single hander that can be used with both hands - ie a d/hander aswell. They too have adopted the thinking above, and now numerous lines exist but the same thinking applies: use skinny thin running line and a very heavy front end.
The reason both types of rods are of the heavier weight is that they tend to be used fro chucking large, heavy flies and it's easier and safer, once you get the casting technique correct(!), to fire them out with less line aerialised.
Again, very simply speaking...
Have a look on Rene's Manic Tackle site - a better explanantion is bound to be on there.
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| Post Number: 9
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Tore
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Posted on: Mar. 29 2011,21:48 |
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There isn't a standard for switch lines, but there is a standard for single hand and spey lines. The swith lines are closer to the single hand system than the spey system. A long belly spey 6wt is 70'-80' long and the head weighs 39 grams.
Rio's Switch 6wt line has a head of 55' in length and weighs 26 grams.
In other words, you can use a SH line on a switch rod (long belly preferably) but you'd struggle with a spey line. The typical switch lines tend to be somewhere in between the two. Personally I think the most practical application for a switch rod is skagit style fishing.
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| Post Number: 10
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jafa
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Joined: Jul. 2008
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Posted on: Mar. 29 2011,22:11 |
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Thanks Tore, I am inclined to get a 5wt switch (+/- a 5/6 12"6" spey), rather than an 8wt. I'll let you know the outcome.
And I will check out Rene's Manic Tackle website.
Cheers.
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